Brian's Repower - Gas to Diesel - 12/05

Brian Davin · Post by **Brian Davin** » Thu Jul 06, 2006 2:26 pm

Frank, I haven't installed flowscans (yet TBD) but I did install a Cruz Pro fuel gauge: http://www.cruzpro.com/fu30.html Ideal time since tank was empty. I also installed new WEMA fuel sender too (23"): http://www.wemausa.com/eshop/index.htm Tank took 308 gallons total. In fact, fuel was Bio-Diesel, which supposedly has a 50 Cetane rating. Yanmars are suppose to run on 44 or 46 Cetan or better (I think those are the numbers), but often regular diesel is only 40 - 42 Cetane according to Eddie. He thinks the engines will run better on higher Cetane and smoke even less. The benefit of this guage is that I input fuel level every 20 gallons as I filled up, so it takes into account the V-Bottom of the tank, which should give me a very acurate fuel level reading, whether I fill tank or partially fill tank. I'll let you know how it works. I may top off before running to CT and will fill once I get to CT to gauge consumption. Stay tuned! Also, Eddie is going to switch me to 22" x 26" props tomorrow to see if I can get out of the hole faster, yet maintain similar top end rpm. Cross your fingers! Doug, I'm questioning the 3100 rpm cruise a little myself, and have put a call into Yanmar to get their perspective, I'll let you know what I find out. Brian '90 Bertram 33' FBC Never Say Never Guilford, CT (Homeport) Kinnelon, NJ (Home)

photo finish · Post by **photo finish** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:12 am

biodiesel Brian? I did not think that was available to marinas yet ...Does it smell like french fries?

GMarty · Post by **GMarty** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 4:53 am

Sweet!

Brian Davin · Post by **Brian Davin** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:02 am

Someone bring the ketchup! George, What was the final size of your props? How many knots are you turning at 3800 r.p.m.s? Just curious, Eddie on my third set of props trying to get it right. We're now at 22 x 26. Brian '90 Bertram 33' FBC Never Say Never Guilford, CT (Homeport) Kinnelon, NJ (Home)

Post by **dougl33** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:07 am

Brian, What are the latest results? Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

GMarty · Post by **GMarty** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:47 am

Brian, Don't remember the prop size off hand although I suspect Eddy will. I have not run at 3900 (WOT) too much but depending on wind and current about 27 knots. Sounds like your getting some serious speed! For the life of me I don't know when you think you will be able to run that fast though. I am really learning that this boat is made to run at 22 knots and that 25-27 is too much even in medium roughness. I ran to Newport and pushed her a bit at times (25 knots) and nearly bounced honey out the back - and it was not that rough. I agree with your wife about lashing down the kids! Do you think it came out good?

Brian Davin · Post by **Brian Davin** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 9:02 am

Doug, Latest numbers went up slightly: Against wind: 2500...........20.6 knots 2800...........24.8 knots 3100...........27.9 knots 3300...........29.8 knots Wind the Wind: 2500...........22.0 knots 2800...........25.8 knots 3100...........29.0 knots 3300...........30.8 knots This performance is with the 22 x 26 props and the recently added 90 gallon water tank installed and full. Trim tabs seem to provide some help with heavy load. Beginning to think the oversized rudders High Tide Marine now has would be beneficial? George, I thought you were running WOT at 4200 r.p.m.s with your props? That's why I was curious what max rated r.p.m.s at 3800 were turning for knots. In terms of speed and waves, I be able to provide more perspective once I get out of Naragansett Bay. Don't forget, I'm the low H.P in the bigger sleeved block, you're the higher H.P in the non-sleeved block. I'll have the speed if I can use it or will be able to economize at the lower speeds and r.p.m.s if I choose. I also have a heavier hull weight than you now with heavier generator, heavier engines and 20 gallons more water capacity. We cut right through a Bertram 46 wake at close range doing 27 knots and my wife could believe how well it sliced right through it. Only time will tell, why don't you bring yours over to the Oak Bluffs Bertram rendezvous on one of the days and we can do some side by side comparisons. Hope you can make it? Brian '90 Bertram 33' FBC Never Say Never Guilford, CT (Homeport) Kinnelon, NJ (Home)

Post by **dougl33** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 9:30 am

Brian, Those numbers seem pretty good. You could cruise at 2800 rpms all day long (about 85% of WOT) and get 25-26 knots. Nothing wrong with that. Now we just need to get your fuel burn. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

GMarty · Post by **GMarty** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 9:50 am

Brian, You put way more thought into all these numbers than I do. I never run my boat WOT and never plan to. I guess you are right though that my speed of 27 may in fact go up a tad if I pinned it for a bit because it will turn 4100 (or so). Then again, I am busy holding on at that point! Can't do OB - prime time for offshore fishing that weekend and I will be flexing my new found range. Again, do you think it came out good? Is he back under control? I am getting close to check-up time.

Post by **dougl33** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 10:01 am

George, You should run your boat up to WOT every so often just to make sure that it is getting the max rated rpms. This is especially important with diesels. I'm not saying you need to do it every time you go out, but every once in a while would do the trick. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

photo finish · Post by **photo finish** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 10:17 am

Brian, Are you really burning biodiesel made with french fry oil? I am sure you will be happy to find out what your fuel burn is.Your top end is about the same as my gassers but your cruise speed is about 3 knots faster. I do not think i will want to know how little fuel you will burn at my cruising speed of 22 knots.I burn about 35gph.My mpg is about the same between 21-23knots. I usually run at around 22 knots because the boat and engines feel right at that speed. It is a nice feeling knowing that if you have to kick it in gear and run 30 knots for whatever reason .....You can!

photo finish · Post by **photo finish** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 10:28 am

Brian, I think your props sound like you are pretty close.I am shocked that your marina would have been that far off to start with.From everything that i have read and the people that i have talked with it sure sounds like a 22" prop is the maximum fit for our boats.A 24" prop does not provide enough clearance.and provides no added benefit.Are your props 4 bladed nibral? And i was assuming that all of our prop shafts are at the same angle when i say the clearance off 24" is too much.They probably are not.

Brian Davin · Post by **Brian Davin** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 11:36 am

George, Yes, George, I think it came out great, but I've been disappointed with the amount of clean-up and reassembly work I've had to do in order to get my boat back. When you spend the kind of money we just did, the boat should be delivered fully buttoned up and not having to chase down the final items I have had to. They still have to bolt down my ladder and attach railing up top and they haven't even washed the boat, which I'm sure I'll end up doing, among other things. Yeah, they're top notch mechanics and fiberglass pros, but would I do it all over again at JBW, not a chance, unless I had a solid contract, installment payments as work progressed and an agreed to timeline. Regarding top end speed, I was simply trying to identify for future repower candidates what a bertram 33 with 315's runs at 3800 r.p.m.s (max r.p.m.s) vs. a Bertram 33 with 370's running at 3300 r.p.m.s (max r.p.m.s) so they can decide if the added cost is worth it or not. You and I can't change our mind cause we're the guinea pigs. If you're doing 27 knots at 3900 rpms, then I'm guessing you hit about 26 knots at 3800 rpms whereas I'm hitting approximately 30 - 31 knots at 3300 rpms. Only a 4 - 5 knot difference and as you said, it all depends on whether you can ever use that 4 - 5 knots in reality? Time will tell. Also, if you're still able to hit 4100 to 4200 rpms WOT, Mack Boring would tell you you're underproped, I believe. I've been consulting with Mack Boring every step of the way on mine. This is an expensive investment and I'm just trying to insure mine is operating in the proper range. Eddie's now working on the Carolina Hull repower outside the door that was promised for April 1 and he's already moved another repower boat into the shed ahead of Syd's 33' who he promised to haul on June 8th. As of Sunday when I left, Syd is still in the water. That 26 refurbish in that was in the back all winter is now getting painted. Tim, That's what they told me, it's Biodiesel! I certainly hope the fuel consumption will be a big savings, we'll see. Regarding the props, my gas engines had 3 blade 24 x 24. Also, I'm guessing the new struts for the 1 3/4" shafts on mine might be taller, but I'm not sure. I'm heading up to the Cape for a week vacation on the boat starting next Saturday. So much for carpeting and new blinds[:(!] Brian '90 Bertram 33' FBC Never Say Never Guilford, CT (Homeport) Kinnelon, NJ (Home)

sbeer · Post by **sbeer** » Mon Jul 10, 2006 3:59 pm

Brian..... you da man. Go baby, power is the way to go. If you need it you got it. I would have done the same. Behind you one hundred percent. Mike

Aussie Syd · Post by **Aussie Syd** » Tue Jul 11, 2006 10:04 pm

Brian I must say I agree with you regarding Eddie Johnston, its starting to looks like I will be doing my re-power back in Aus ,he has had my boat sitting in the water at his yard for the past 6 weeks as you know, does not reply to my e-mails will not give a starting date or completing date and when I have phoned will say that he will be starting next week every time I have asked. When I first met him he seamed a real helpful guy and assured me a 6 week turn around, I can't believe the way this guy has changed since he has got my boat and my deposit.I understand the weather has not helped and he may have lost one of his machanics but I have already given him 6 weeks leeway before I have started to pull him up over the delays.Sure a lot of marine yards can be somewhat unreliable with quotes and budgets etc... but I think this has now gone to far without anything happening. My shipping agent has been helpful with Eddie, and is going to see him in the coming week I left instructions if he cannot get a firm commitment from Eddie, to start preparing the boat for shipping that would mean I would be back in your neck of the woods very shortly. I am begining to wonder if this Bertram 33 Sport fisherman is really worth it,and if any one is looking to make me any sort of offer to buy it I just might seriously look at it. One brown off Aussie Syd