Wet Generator From Bilge Splash and it's cooked

[sbeer]

Its a flat sheet with an edge that mounts to the bulkhead forward of the gen. It extends past the gen towards the stern. 2 wood srews mount it to the bulkhead. Just bow the piece to get it into the hatch. I do not get any water on gen through wash downs and so forth. I pull hatches and am constantly cleaning bilge with fresh water. Easy fix and works great. Mike

[Admin]

quote:Originally posted by sbeer My aft bilge pump has a float and switch on the bridge to either go auto or manual. I have my genny on marine ply with a back splash shield to help in splashing. I run it on auto all the time and do not get any water on the gen. I did make a lexan cover that mounts on the forward bulhead of the hatch. It covers the gen and half of the engine. Any issues I just lift hatch and I have full view of the gen. Mike Mike Lawrence 81 sportfish 33' shot'n'beer [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... N_Beer.JPG[/img] I have a similar setup also, and no problems. I also keep it in auto all the time.

[IRGuy]

Thanks Mike.. sounds like a good idea. My Mase gennie is in a sound shield box.. when I opened it the first time after I bought the boat the generator was completely covered with what appeared to be condensation.. so I now am looking for a good way to keep the cover opened somewhat but still keep the rain out when the hatch leaks at the slip. I have not yet repaired the hatch scupper drain hose fittings.. just not a priority with so many other things to do. Frank B - IRGuy@aol.com "Phoenix" 1983 FBC

[banispeter]

Correct the claim may not be able to be made against Bertram for design defect. However, as to a carrier, the issue is insured loss and claim frequency (i.e., redundancy). If a carier has had a history of substantially identical claims resulting from a design error and do not warn the insured about the condition as an exception to covergae they cannot deny coverge because insurance law assumes the carrier with knowledge of the frequency of identical claims has then built the cost of coverage into the premium. It would then be their burden to show (1) statistically not significant frequency of type of claim and (2) statistically not significant substantially identical claims for the subject vessel type (and that last one gets them into the realm of all vessels with gennies under cockpit hatches and they would there no pun intended sink). So, anyone favor me with their carrier exeperience? Peter L. Banis KNOT AGAIN Boston, MA

[Sean B]

quote:Originally posted by banispeter Correct the claim may not be able to be made against Bertram for design defect. However, as to a carrier, the issue is insured loss and claim frequency (i.e., redundancy). If a carier has had a history of substantially identical claims resulting from a design error and do not warn the insured about the condition as an exception to covergae they cannot deny coverge because insurance law assumes the carrier with knowledge of the frequency of identical claims has then built the cost of coverage into the premium. It would then be their burden to show (1) statistically not significant frequency of type of claim and (2) statistically not significant substantially identical claims for the subject vessel type (and that last one gets them into the realm of all vessels with gennies under cockpit hatches and they would there no pun intended sink). So, anyone favor me with their carrier exeperience? Ever hear the term frivolous lawsuit? Jeez why don't you sue them because your props hit a rock or because your boat got wet. This is precisely why all the insurance companies keep raising premuims on everything. I had a genny fail last year and I want no part of this. It's not a design defect. Having the genny under the cockpit deck it is a trade-off like every other boat design decision: some good things about it, some bad. If it was under the cabin deck everyone would be bitching about noise. The rusty Bertram generator under the cockpit deck is as famous as their corroding rub rails- it is a common knowledge trait of the boats. And as for sticking it to the insurance companies, well, maybe it's possible but that doesn't make it right. My unvarnished two cents Sean Burlingham "Island Time" 1987 Bertram 33 SF Melbourne, FL SBurlingham@cfl.rr.com [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... d_Time.jpg[/img]

[Capt. Ed]

Sean, I agree! It is needless claims that cost us all. I watched it happen in the aviation trade. Manufactures were being held liability for planes built 60 years prior! So a $50,000 plane now cost $200,000 because of product liability claims. The same I am sure applies to the marine industry as well. 1979 Bertram 33' FBC ALEXANDRA Port Richey, Florida [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... xandra.jpg[/img] HAVE YOU SIGNED UP FOR BERTRAM PRIDE '06 yet? DO IT NOW... SPACE IS LIMITED!

[franklyprice]

Ditto Sean's comments. Next we won't be able to get insurance on old Bertrams because they cost too much in claims. Forget leaking gas tanks, Why? Wet gensets.W T F ? Use the genset once in awhile and keep it exercised. When it goes bad, replace it. It's a boat, an old one at that. It's going to cost money. Get used to the idea.

[Sean B]

Ed & Frank: I'm glad I'm not the only person in the world who feels this way! Maybe there is still hope after all... Sean Burlingham "Island Time" 1987 Bertram 33 SF Melbourne, FL SBurlingham@cfl.rr.com [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... d_Time.jpg[/img]

[Jose Jaen]

Let`s keep our beloved hobby from suffering the fate my profession has due to frivolous lawsuits. The consecuences reach far beyond cost increases. Four to eight hour waits in E.R., non availability of essential services such as Ob-gyn and neurosurgery affecting mostly rural areas and early retirement or relocation of experienced physicians who dread losing their hard earned belongings to extorsion are some of the known effects. The physician`s primordial instinct to assist those in need is at stake; many will look the other way if confronted with an emergency on the road. All of the above act in detriment to the sick`s wellbeing, the object of our profession. If this litigiousness were to plague boating many enthusiasts will no longer afford it. Jose Jaen "Blue Chip" 1993 33FBC Miami FL [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... p_Jaen.jpg[/img]

[sbeer]

Its that good ole saying " use it, or lose it" Mike

[banispeter]

Well, I got the message, but... 1. The aircraft lawsuit referenced as suing upon a 60 year old plane had facts a bit different from that stated. The FAA and NTSB require, as commanded by Federal statute, every aircraft maunfacturer to notify them of any discovered design defect which in their defined parlance could negatively affect the airworthiness of an aircraft currently in receipt of such an airworthiness certificate and the facts of the case showed the manufacturer had actual knowledge of such a defect that airworthiness would have been revoked. The Federal law under which that reporting requirement exists has no statute of limitations to protect aicraft manufacturers because Congress decided it was better to require planes not fit to fly be grounded than just plain fall from the sky. The manufacturer was found to have intentionally failed to report a defect which would have resulted under FAA rules the grounding of all of that make of craft because the manufacturer feared loss of business, and, they got absolutely pounded for such an act and rightly so because it is in fact involuntary manslaughter and could well be manslaughter depending upon the jurisdiction when people die in planes that should not be flying and the manufacturer knew it. And you think that was a frivolous lawsuit? The Dept. of Justice joined the side of the Plaintiffs and the FBI did the investigation for them. Frivolus indeed. People went to jail. 2. If a true techie could get inside the actuarial files of any marine carrier there would be a claims history and their statistical determination of the number of claims they would be foced to pay, as well as the frequency of claim for such a defect. They know it's there and because of that they insure it or they exclude it. Your Legislature I don't care what state you are in has insurance underwriting regulations which require a carrier to just that; insure it or exclude it as to known claims with a designated frequency of occurence. It is for your protection as a consumer and the case law puts the burden on the carrier to show the rate of incidence to be below the designated frequency. 3. The volume of replies concerning "everybody knew about the gennies getting wet" will satisfy the designated frequency requirement and most certainly here in the People's Republic of Massachusetts. 4. As for the doc lamenting the cost of insurance well, I don't have the time to answer that nor the patience. I've known practicing plaintiff and insurance defense guys for more than a quarter century and both would differ with the doc from their experience. We pay a ton in malpractice insurance for 5 and 25 coverage and have never had a claim since I started the shop in 1980 and don't expect to, but, I've known so many so called colleagues who only passed one bar in their life and know too why coverage costs THEM so much, not us. Anyone really think an insurance carrier in med mal cases pays out on bogus claims? C'mon. 5. Generally, for those of you who think claims equal premiums isn't that supposed to be how it works? That is after all the fundamental principle of insurance. The extension of your position/logic is that if no one could have any right to make any claim we could do away with insurance entirely. The wet gennie is a condition not a claim. The claim comes when the carrier knows of the condition but fails to exclude the condition from coverage; they must then cover it. Your state's insurance statutes and regulations say that in plain language. Would you have it any other way, really? 6. You want me to tell you when they cover the claim without a deductible or not? 7. Genny was 3 years old with less than 100 hours. 6.5 Kw Onan. With a complete sound shield (which rusted out).

[dougl33]

quote:Originally posted by banispeter 7. Genny was 3 years old with less than 100 hours. 6.5 Kw Onan. With a complete sound shield (which rusted out). And yet mine is going on 20 years and still running. This leads me to believe there are other variables at work. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

[franklyprice]

Peter, All good and interesting points but it still makes me kinda sick that we live in a world where someone can sue anyone for a problem on something that was made over 20 years ago. You could use that same logic to just about any manufacturer of anything ever made. Then what would the world be like? Besides, I'm pretty sure that your rusty genset isn't going to kill anyone. I will stick by my recommendation to exercise the thing more often. Something just ain't right . Your genset is the same age as mine , in the same place on the boat and mine looks essentially like the day I bought it, with no sound shield.Mine is installed low in the boat, on a fiberglass board which may shield it from water below but it doesn't get very wet. In fact I question why all the noise about this being a bad place for a genset since the original one lasted 18 years. You may be carrying around too much bilge water in your boat or your boat may leak, causing the bilge water to be salty.If things are right on your boat, the only water in your bilge should be rain water, with the exception of a saltwater washdown when you fish.(if you fish) I do also agree with you that lack of claims isn't going to guarantee that our premiums won't go up but it has to stop somewhere. Obviously you work in this type of industry and know the ins and outs of it but really, if you spent as much time with your boat and checking on things and using them, you probably wouldn't have to worry about who is going to pay for them when they mess up. Some thoughts to ponder .

[Capt. Ed]

All good points, however, if we make all these claims and the insurance carrier, like any business evaluates the profitability of a market decides that it is not worth the trouble, then where do we go for hull insurance? 1979 Bertram 33' FBC ALEXANDRA Port Richey, Florida [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... xandra.jpg[/img] HAVE YOU SIGNED UP FOR BERTRAM PRIDE '06 yet? DO IT NOW... SPACE IS LIMITED!

[Jose Jaen]

What a spin. Can anyone see the word INSURANCE anywhere in my 8/26 note? This used to be fun site to read everyday. Jose Jaen "Blue Chip" 1993 33FBC Miami FL [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... p_Jaen.jpg[/img]