Boat US safety Alert

Capt. Ed · Post by **Capt. Ed** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:20 am

Two glasses, a strip and a tank... sounds more like a frat house party to me. [:p] PARTY!... PARTY!... PARTY! 1979 Bertram 33' FBC ALEXANDRA Port Richey, Florida HAVE YOU SIGNED UP FOR BERTRAM PRIDE '06 yet? DO IT NOW... SPACE IS LIMITED!

Post by **dougl33** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:53 am

The latest I have recieved from Boat Useless: Hi Doug, Yes, it doesn’t seem likely we’ll be lobbying for going back to the use of leaded gasoline for boats; it’s too expensive. I’ve been corresponding with members in the Great Lakes who’ve used ethanol for many years and it doesn’t appear to be the problem that some people are making it out to be. They had problems with hoses initially and that was it. No one I’ve corresponded with has had any complaints. The other problem, one they didn’t have in the Midwest, is that switching from MTBE to ethanol creates a gunk when the two are mixed together. Also, the ethanol will clean the inside of the tank and cause more problems with filters. This also is corrected over time. I think we’ll likely join NMMA in battling against the 20% ethanol proposed in Minnesota. Regards, Bob Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

BECCA ROSE · Post by **BECCA ROSE** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 12:01 pm

How is it possible that they can grow enough corn to produce enough ethanol for all this gas they want to produce?? Frank had a good response as to why there was no problems in the midwest when ethanol arrived there some 10+ years ago, it's because there was no internet to spread all the stories about the problems they were having! Plus, as Bob said, they didn't have MTBE mixing with Ethanol, DUH! No wonder there where no problems! Like Bob also said, "problems will be corrected over time" and with a few thousand dollars... Bill 33 FBC Ipswich, Ma. [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... a_Rose.jpg[/img]

Post by **dougl33** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 5:28 am

Ths just in from MSN, Bush is taking some action: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12469582/?GT1=7938 It mentions: Easing the environment rules will allow refiners greater flexibility in providing oil supplies since they will not have to use certain additives such as ethanol to meet clean air standards. Who knows what that actually means for us. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

captgene · Post by **captgene** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 9:17 am

If Bush is taking some action , you can bet the reason is probably something to do with how much money he might lose. I'm pretty sure he doesn't really give a crap about how much fun we'll miss for not having the $ for fuel, or the destruction of our boats. Gene Dugan

lobsta1 · Post by **lobsta1** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 10:04 am

Doug, I doubt if it will make a damm bit of difference. Remember as of May 5th the oil companies are no longer protected from MTBE lawsuits. Also the companies get a $.50 subdidy per gallon of CORN (political payoff) ethanol used. No federal subsidy for sugar beet or any other biomass used. Plus, both MTBE & eth are used as octane boosters. What are they going to use in their place? If you're placing your hopes in Gorkies hands, I'll bet I could sell you some prime real estate out in the middle of Stellwagon Bank! Al 1978 33 FBC NITES OFF

BECCA ROSE · Post by **BECCA ROSE** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 12:03 pm

Good news, gas stations are running out of gas because they can not make ethanol fast enough. This whole ethanol thing just isn't going to work. Let's build some refineries, drill in Alaska, and increase our own reserves so prices don't spike every time some country farts, and we'll be just fine. Bill 33 FBC Ipswich, Ma. [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... a_Rose.jpg[/img]

Rick · Post by **Rick** » Sun May 07, 2006 2:08 am

I saw 10% Ethanol at Danversport and have heard it's all over the cape. Currently looking at Racor Filters....but it doesn't look like they make any with anything larger than a 3/8" fitting. My engines want 1/2" fuel lines minimum.....it's already getting fun.

franklyprice · Post by **franklyprice** » Sun May 07, 2006 3:13 am

Rick, From what I gather from all the talk about this issue, the first thing I would (and am going to) do is make sure your tank is as close to empty as you feel comfortable with before filling up with the new fuel, then keep an eye on the color of the gas going through the filters. It wouldn't hurt to pull a plug once in awhile to see if they're getting any goo on them. Also keep a few spare filters on board in case they clog. Maybe spinning a filter off once in awhile to see the color of the gas wouldn't be a bad idea. It sounds like whatever is gumming up these engines will go through just about any filters, so if you are getting sludge or your gas tank dissolving into your fuel, you just have to hope it isn't enough to stick your valves. At that point I'd add a bunch of Techron to the gas . Then, cross your fingers.

Rick · Post by **Rick** » Sun May 07, 2006 3:46 am

Frank, I'm definitely on that program. Make what I have last as long as possible, filter up as much as possible and monitor the situation. It probably wouldn't be a bad aidea to take a sample of the gas I have now so that I have something to compare once the ethanol is in the tank. Do you know what to look for relative to the color of the gas if the tank is starting to break down ? Sounds like a purple-ish kind of color ? Rick Ticket 85 SF Falmouth, MA

franklyprice · Post by **franklyprice** » Sun May 07, 2006 5:44 am

Rick, I certainly don't have any first hand knowledge about the color it may turn but I thought I recall people saying it was a brown color? It would make sense for it to be brown if it was breaking down the tank or dissolving sludge in the tank. I guess I'd be wondering about it if it turned any color at all but what it was when it went in the tank. Purple-ish just doesn't sound too scarey, in fact I think avgas and race fuel are sometimes puple-ish colored. Brown fuel? Now that sounds scarey.

Rick · Post by **Rick** » Sun May 07, 2006 7:21 am

Yeah, Jim described it as a brownish-red, guess time will tell. Do we even know how long it takes the ethanol to break down the tank ? Is it slow enough that this can be a winter project ? Guess we wouldn't want to take that chance. It's pretty bad that we've got to do incoming inspection on gas that's $3+/gallon ! Rick Ticket 85 SF Falmouth, MA

franklyprice · Post by **franklyprice** » Sun May 07, 2006 11:53 am

Rick, We don't know yet that 10% ethanol will actually break down the tank. Still too many questions to be answered , at least in my mind.One big thing though, don't let the old gas and the new gas mix and stay in the tank for long periods(like all summer or winter storage). I believe that will be easier said than done because of the way we use our boats and the price of fuel , no one uses tank after tank to flush out the old gas, like you might in a car.Instead the gas mixes and stays in the tank for most of the summer and then gets layed up for winter with whatever is in the tank.

Post by **dougl33** » Sun May 07, 2006 3:57 pm

Has anyone with out a flo-scan installed figured out how they're going to run most of the old gas out? I don't about you guys, but I don't trust the guage once it gets below a half tank. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

Rick · Post by **Rick** » Mon May 08, 2006 4:06 am

Good question ! I have no idea, but was considering of doing the unthinkable and running the boat outside of the harbor until it just ran out of gas. Have a buddy tow me in with a skiff, change filters and fill her up. I know it's not good to do that, but in this case I think it's better than the alternative. I think you can buy plastic hand pumps, but where do you put the unused gas and dispose of it ? Could sell it at $2/gallon or just use it in our cars. Maybe we should all go in on a big portable container(s) and pump 'em out one at a time ? Rick Ticket 85 SF Falmouth, MA