Hard top question

sbeer · Post by **sbeer** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 8:37 am

Anyone ever replaced their soft top with a hard top? Who would make it? Can they use the same tower and bolt it on or modify it? Any info would be apreciated.

IRGuy · Post by **IRGuy** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 10:23 am

Mike... I was considering that after I bought "Phoenix" and the soft top, which was paper thin and probably 15 years old, was holed in several places in a hail storm. It needed to be replaced, so it was a good time to change. But then I read one of Pascoe's articles where he said that in hurricanes the boat heels over and the top acts like a sail, dragging the boat sideways, with a lot of force created by the top now sideways in the wind. After thinking about that for a while (I live in North Carolina, after all!) I decided to replace the soft top.. I have not woven it onto the frame permanently, as a lot of people do, but instead have used electrical wiring tie wraps for now. My plan is to simply cut these and remove the top when a hurricane is forecast so I can get rid of the top quickly. Frank B - IRGuy@aol.com "Phoenix" 1983 FBC Wilmington, NC

buzzk · Post by **buzzk** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:39 pm

I wouldn't think it would be very hard to change over from a soft top to a hard top. Wouldn't the hard top have to be custom made anyway? Having had a soft top in the past and having a hard top on my Bertram, I like the hard top better. Buzz buzzk 1988 Bertram 33 FBC Buzz Off Morehead City, NC

Sean B · Post by **Sean B** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 5:33 pm

quote:in hurricanes the boat heels over and the top acts like a sail, dragging the boat sideways, with a lot of force created by the top now sideways in the wind. That happens to me sometimes when running in a stiff cross-wind with my soft top - it will tend to list the boat something fierce. I can correct with trim tabs and then all is good, but if you're on a cruise to nowhere (and thus not trying terribly hard to hold a course) I'll eventually loose the heading a bit... the wind catches the other way and it rolls the boat over on the other side. Then it's back to the trim tabs to correct again. The wind definitely will grab that and turn the boat sideways. It's got to be worse on a FBC than on a SF too. But that being said, I've got a soft top and I floated just fine through four storms (two less that 100 MPH tropicals, and two fairly strong hurricanes) during which I never un-threaded all that string to release the top beforehand. In fact with my (fairly) new radar mount, I'd now have to basically cut and destory the soft top to remove it. During all four storms I sat nearby and watched her, a lot... and yes the boat heeled over momentarily in gusts... but if there are enough lines on her it doesn't matter. I don't know if that makes a difference or not... but I would think dismantling a hard top for a storm would be easier than dismantling a soft top. So I say get the hard top if you want it. When the event actually comes, you'll probably NOT go through the work of taking either off for a storm anyway. Sean Burlingham "Island Time" 1987 Bertram 33 SF Melbourne, FL SBurlingham@cfl.rr.com [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... d_Time.jpg[/img]

Sean B · Post by **Sean B** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 5:52 pm

I should also mention that, during my windstorm observations - there was a certain amount of pride in watching that my Bertram moved around a whole lot less than others' boats. She heeled over much less in sideways gusts and also pitched less in general from the big waves that moved through the harbor. My marina neighbors' Sea Ray's and Silvertons were all over the place, and most of my productive function in being there was to add lines to their violently thrashing boats, to keep them where they belonged. I'd waste time bragging to them about it, but of course they wouldn't believe because they weren't around in the marina during the storm to witness the carnage... they probably bugged out of town with the other 99.9% of the population. The only other guy I ever saw around during the height of the crap and beer-sitting boats, besides the two marina owners, was a Hatt Owner - go figure. Sean Burlingham "Island Time" 1987 Bertram 33 SF Melbourne, FL SBurlingham@cfl.rr.com [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... d_Time.jpg[/img]

IRGuy · Post by **IRGuy** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 6:51 am

Sean.. Thanks for the comments.. I had not thought about the issues when underway.. not that there is much we can do other than adjust trim tabs. I had a new soft top made locally by a guy who seems to know his stuff.. I took him my old tattered one and he copied it, and it fits perfectly. My helper in Charleston installed it alone one day, and before I could tell him not to he put the bolts for two antenna mounts through it on the port side of the pipe frame.. I have bought some stainless U bolts and will use these to permanently mount the antennas to the frame after I cut slits in the top so the top can be removed in one piece in a hurry. At this time I do not have a radar.. but naturally would like to have one in the future, so a mount for that will have to consider the top removal issue for me. I am looking for a simple and neat way attach the top to the frame.. the plastic tie wraps are not pretty, and the first ones he used were not UV resistant, so after two seasons they began to break on their own.. I have replaced them with black UV rated ones, which I hope will last longer. I have seen several techniques for weaving a piece of small nylon line through the grommets and around the frame, but have to think this is a bother to install and remove. I am about to start the boat rebuild.. have just pretty much finished the house, and have bigger boat issues to deal with so for the present the tie wraps will stay. I think we have pretty much put the hurricane season behind us, so I think the top will remain as it is for the winter. Frank B - IRGuy@aol.com "Phoenix" 1983 FBC Wilmington, NC

buzzk · Post by **buzzk** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 8:07 am

I live on a well protected deep water creek and leave my boats behind my house during hurricanes and tropical storms and we have weathered a good number of them over the years. My friends usually bring their boats over to my docks. We do take precations, double the lines, taking down most canvas, secure everything, etc. I haven't seen anyone have any problems caused by a hard top or leaving their soft tops on. I have seen people lose Bimini Tops, canvas that was left up, antennae and outriggers break but not soft tops secured to a rigid frame. I'm sure it does happen but I'm not worried about my hard top. If it's that bad with or without the hard top I'm in trouble. Besides most of the time it's the high water where we live that causes the most problems. Buzz buzzk 1988 Bertram 33 FBC Buzz Off Morehead City, NC

smanni · Post by **smanni** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:07 am

MIke - If you get a quote let me know. I am interested in the same thing. I would like to put a fiberglass panel on the inside area as well to cover up the pitted supports. I want to install lights, them a fiberglass skin, then a hardtop.

CB35 · Post by **CB35** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:37 am

Mike my 35B just has a thin fiberglass skin on top of my Pipe Welders tower. In fact it is two pieces screwed and sealed in the middle. Simple and probably cheaper then a canvas replacement. Charlie

IRGuy · Post by **IRGuy** » Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:27 am

As I recall the cost a year ago for my soft top, with I believe Stamoid fabric and GoreTex thread was about $350, including the reinforced patches, and stainless grommets about every 4". Frank B - IRGuy@aol.com "Phoenix" 1983 FBC Wilmington, NC

Post by **dougl33** » Fri Nov 16, 2007 6:01 am

It seems to me that the further south you go, the canvas/enclosure guys and mechanics get cheaper. There's simply more market so more competition. Conversely, it seems that slips get more expensive. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

Think Big · Post by **Think Big** » Fri Nov 16, 2007 6:08 pm

Mike when I bought the boat it had a hard top on it so I don't know much about the soft tops. The boat came from Clark's and was called Mack The Knife I don't know if you have ever seen it. I was told the top was made by Tower Power. The boat is now in the Raritan Bay a little north of you. If you would like to look at it let me know? The top looks very well made to me. George

sbeer · Post by **sbeer** » Tue Dec 11, 2007 11:29 am

I paid 750 bucks for my new soft top 2 yr's ago. I like Charlies idea about the 2 peice. Where did you get it done Charlie? George, Tower power is right next to my Marina. Those guys are alittle bit expensive but it would'nt hurt to get a Qoute. Sean, When I get the quote I'll post it. Thanks Guys Mike

CB35 · Post by **CB35** » Thu Dec 13, 2007 7:58 am

Mike, Mine came this way from the factory in 1984. Stop over and take a look. To tell you the the truth the job looks very simple. All it is a thin fiberglass skin painted white on the top and light blue on the underside. Maybe I should go in the business of making these? Charlie

modick · Post by **modick** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 4:08 pm

Mike, Did you replace your soft top with a hard top? I did last Spring. I ordered it from Atlantic Towers in N.J. They already had the design and I just modified it. Dick Fraser 88 FB 33'