Gas Tank....any verdict reached ???

Rick · Post by **Rick** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 3:44 am

Ken et al, I went with stainless because of the potential Aluminum problems mentioned above and the fact that Stainless performs so well in a marine environment. Ken, you might want to pull that pick-up line and check it out. There's a screened sock around the pick up that could be clogged. Pulling the deck isn't as bad as it looks. There's a lot of screws, but you're really looking at about 3-4 hours of work to get it done. Pulling the tank, you'll probably need a come-a-long as illustrated in the postings from Al & I. Set aside an entire day for that. I wasn't convinced that I had to change the tank, but I had the time last Fall and wasn't sure when I would have that time again. I also had a lot of "varnish" in my gas that I figured was the cleansing of the old tank with ethanol in there. Cleaning that sock helped a lot. It got better toward the end of the season but had me nervous that it would never go away. Rick Ticket 85 SF Falmouth, MA

Post by **dougl33** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 6:30 am

Sean, No, you did not offend me and I wasn't trying to start a competition between the 2 sites. Having spent a lot of time on this subject (on both sites), I've just found that the 31 site deals more with changing the tanks than trying to narrow down a cause. There is definately some good info there, I just think there's more subjective and informative info here. As I've said all along, there are way too many variables involved to say that all fiberglass tanks are screwed due to ethanol and everytime I see/hear comments and/or stories stating as much it drives me crazy as they all contribute to driving down the values of all of our fine boats (20's, 25's, 28's, 31's, 33's, etc...). Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

Sean B · Post by **Sean B** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 9:43 am

I agree, over there they do tend to gravitate to the sweeping conclusion that the FG tanks are simply dissolving in ethanol and need to be replaced... which doesn't appear to be the case for every boat. It does seem to me that the problem might have as much or more to do with the years of built-up crap in the tanks, or the tanks simply being old and deteriorating naturally, than just the tank resin melting in every boat. Seems that every boat's tank and potential for an ethanol problem could be unique to every boat. But who cares what I think - this subject has been beaten to death, with opinions of every kind. I put whole thing into the category of: nothing on a boat lasts forever. The public can value my boat at whatever amount it wants to, I don't care.... I know what it's worth to me and I'm not selling. That being said, do you really think that the values of Bertrams have dropped because of the ethanol/FG tank issue? If so, maybe we should all just shut up! Sean Burlingham "Island Time" 1987 Bertram 33 SF Melbourne, FL SBurlingham@cfl.rr.com [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... d_Time.jpg[/img]

Post by **dougl33** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 9:51 am

Sean, We already know from looking at Al's tank that the fg tanks aren't as forever as we all thought. Maybe Al had a tank that was made on Monday morning or Friday afternoon? Or maybe, it was just at the end of its useful life after 28 years? Who knows? We do know, that Rick's 21 year old tank looked fine, and continues to look fine after almost a year of exposure to ethanol (both last summer in his boat and the past 8 months in Frank's shop). That's proof enough to me that ethanol alone is not an issue with the tanks in the later 33's. Without a doubt the values have suffered. I think part of it is due to ethanol, and part is due to the fact that at almost $4 per gallon for gas and in the high $2's for diesel this is getting to be much more of a rich man's past-time (though I certainly do not consider my self either rich or even well to do!). If you take a look at YW often, you'll see the same boats out there (of all sizes) for a long period of time with many drops in price. The ethanol myth has already caused at least one insurer to drop gas powered Betrams. That's why I try and respond to the "all gas powered Bertrams are screwed" posts whenever I see them on any site. John Q Public generally believes the first thing he sees/reads. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

Rick · Post by **Rick** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 10:34 am

I think our boats will have an asterisk next to them for the next 10 years. Whatever the case, there are some good bargains out there. Especially when you compare them to new boats of the same size costing >$300K. Rick Ticket 85 SF Falmouth, MA

Post by **dougl33** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:24 am

Rick, You are 100% correct. Everytime I go to the boat show and see some piece of crap bubble boat listed for $200K plus I ask my wife which boat she'd rather have. Anyone who's met her knows how smart she is as she always answers Bertram! Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

Rick · Post by **Rick** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:40 am

The guy in the slip next to me bought a '01 35 Carolina Classic. Nice boat, beautiful cockpit, good size cabin with twin 330 Cummins. Sold it right away because they couldn't see over the dash board when underway and the windshield was always getting splashed. Guess we're getting off topic....so even if you do have to replace the gas tank, you still got a Bertram ! Rick Ticket 85 SF Falmouth, MA

Capt. Sean · Post by **Capt. Sean** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 8:50 am

Hi Ken , I was in the boat yard the past 2 days ( sand, pait, wax wax wax). I should be around on Sunday if your up in Clinton area stop by, the boat is behind the Aqua restaurant. Sean

amityangler · Post by **amityangler** » Tue Jun 26, 2007 4:57 am

Guys Just wanted to chime in, for what it's worth I have a 1977 conv. So far I have had zero problems with the tank. I keep checking the filters and pull the plugs to look for build-up but so far so good. I keep the boat in Amityville NY in my backyard, not sure how long I,ve been using eth. Charlie

Post by **dougl33** » Tue Jun 26, 2007 5:32 am

Charlie, Thanks for chiming in. What precautions have you been taking? Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

amityangler · Post by **amityangler** » Tue Jun 26, 2007 7:51 am

The only thing I've done is put some additive in last fall for the winter, before that I never did anything. I also tried tapping the bottom of the tank by reaching in the hole above the stuffing boxes with a 3/4" wrench, don't know if it means anything but the tank sounds hard. It's going to take some to get me to rip this thing out unless I see some sign of a problem.

Post by **dougl33** » Tue Jun 26, 2007 7:59 am

So you don't add anything everytime you fuel up? Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

amityangler · Post by **amityangler** » Tue Jun 26, 2007 9:15 am

No, just straight fuel. The yard that hauls my boat just changed the tank on a 28 bert, says it was getting soft. I don't know the answer, It's almost like not all tanks were not made with the same resin

JohnD · Post by **JohnD** » Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:05 am

I just pulled the inspection tank off of my tank (in my B35) and from what I see there's some samll cracks around the seam at the top of the tank on the inside. There's no exerior or interior softness or issues. I'd consider what I see the result of the area where little to no fuel sits and the fiberglass drying out. As for exterior stregth of my tank, the cockpit is out and I can walk on it with no flex, for those that don't know me, I'm not the smallest guy around. I keep the cockpit cover on when the the tank is exposed since it hasn't been painted and I don't want any UV ray's working their evil. Unfortuantely I've had the cockpit out more times than I'd like, once to remove and old tank and once to replace the rudder shelves. Now it's out to rplace the exhaust, fuel lines and all the fun stuff that goes with converting to diesels. I had ethanol in my tank for one season and had no issues/symptoms, just lucky I guess. Though I admit ethanol was the deciding factor for converting to diesels. Between ethanol and rising fuel costs, its the perfect storm for falling boat prices. John D "Lady D" Bertram 35 Pasadena MD

amityangler · Post by **amityangler** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:25 am

That's good to hear, I sort of took the approch that if the tank caused me problems it would force me into going diesel. Right now my 454's are in good shape and I can't justify it even with the price of gas, I would like to have the extra range, like to do some canyon fishing.