35 Bert needs help

bert35 · Post by **bert35** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:33 pm

I am looking to complete the repower. I bought the boat with 3208 Cat's. They did not change the inch and 3/8th shafts. I need to: 1. Change running gear 2. Take off tower and put up new hard top. 3. Center the helm chair and build a pod with a wrap around console 4. PAINT IT! The good news is that there is all new teak decks and 700 hours on 3208's. I think that is a good start. Now I need help from the knowledgeable 35' owners. Are there any suggestions on where to start? Thanks, Chris

Capt. Ed · Post by **Capt. Ed** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 4:07 pm

Chris (Bert35) Welcome aboard! 1979 Bertram 33' FBC ALEXANDRA Port Richey, Florida [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... xandra.jpg[/img] HAVE YOU SIGNED UP FOR BERTRAM PRIDE '06 yet? DO IT NOW... SPACE IS LIMITED!

JohnD · Post by **JohnD** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 3:50 am

Chris, Welcome to Bertram33.com!! Sounds like you've got a good platform to build on, where do you keep your boat? I've got a '72 B35 with gas and have had her a few years. The knowledge and friendship I’ve found here and the other Bertram sites, I believe, are the main reason for me being able to keep and up-keep my Bertram. As for order, I'd do what you mention in the following order 1) running gear 2) bodywork mods (helm re-work and so on) 3) paint 4) hardtop Also, here's some thoughts on the upgrades. Running gear: You should be able to go up to aquamet22 1.5â€� shafts and use a thin-wall bearing in your struts. The struts on the B35 seem to be pretty solid and as long as you’re under 350hp and don’t run her too hard the 1.5â€� shafts will be fine, otherwise you’ll need new struts to go to 1.75â€�. As for Props, maybe Charlie or one of the other guys can chime in. Another thing to consider is the rudder shelves, mine collapsed when I was winterizing the generator 2 years ago and it was a tedious job replacing them, there’s a good how-to on www.bertram31.com for the replacement. As for rudders, I think like the B31, the B35 would benefit (at least my early model) from a set of oversized rudders. I find it hard to seer on one motor. As for the tower/top, it just depends what kind of local fabricators are available to you. When I looked into it last year I found that to have a good hard top made (fiberglass top) it was $8-10k and then an enclosure would have been $4-5k for strataglass and even more for EZ2CY. I wound up having a new bimini and 4 sided enclosure made for around $7k with EZ2CY in the front 1/2 it suits my needs and I can use the money elsewhere. For the Helm, Capt Patrick has a kit for a pod style helm which could probably be fitted to the B35 helm. Another choice would be to make your own or find a local fabricator who could tackle the job. I have the early style bridge, no seating in front, and don’t mind the location of the helm. With it being off set it allows more seating/room to the starboard side. I am going to rework my helm layout this winter though, I have electronics spread all the way across the helm from the previous owner and am going to consolidate everything to within reach of the helm seat. Another thing about my helm is that the chairs are abnormally high and I’ve come to like them that way. They work as both a leaning post and seat. When seated I can steer with my feet & I like that better than being hunched over. Ah painting….. I love the look and hate the longevity. Unless your boat had been painted before or the gel coat can’t be saved I wouldn’t paint. My boat had been painted and it looked great when I got it. Well I’ve had it about 6 years and the paint is probably 12yrs old and really looks it. Now I don’t think that when my boat was painted it got the best most complete job and probably is why it needs it again, but still it stinks to get the estimates of $25k plus for re-painting and that doesn’t include new hardware. If you can do it yourself, that would save you big time. br, JohnD

bert35 · Post by **bert35** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 8:47 am

ED....John, Thanks for the welcome. John, I too have a 72. 1. Yes, the gelcoat is worn to the tune of painting. I may have an out. I have a good friend who paints cars. He offered if I do the prep work. That I can do.....Saving there!! 3208T with 265hp out of each (I am fine with that) at 2250 rpm's I am getting 17 knots. She turns up 2850. I don't buy into the 10 % under rule! 2. Thanks for the advise on the shafts and rudders. I will look to do that. I don't push the boat. So, I have not had a problem. I am certainly looking to prevent! I will also need new props.... Not saving there!! 3. The boat currently has a Pipewelders tower. A guy formerly from Atlantic said that he could cut the tower and change the front and rear legs to look right. However, we would have to powdercoat it.....Not saving there!! 4. The helm is going to be the fun job. I love to work with fiberglass. My problem is too many electronics. I have two of everything. eeny.. meeny.. miney.. moe.. I guess! Info from Patrick would help....Saving there!! The before and after pictures should be very interresting.

Post by **dougl33** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 9:33 am

Chris, I'm curious as to why you think you need to change the shaft size. The 3208 (from 260-320hp) was the diesel option for the 33's. Bertram made all 33 diesels with inch and 3/8ths shafts. Unless you're planning on repowering, I think you'll be fine. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

JohnD · Post by **JohnD** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 11:29 am

Chris, I agree with Doug on the shafts, I thought you had the 320hp. If it's working now I'd leave them until there was a need to upgrade, save some $$$ for the other work. As for electronics I installed a C-80 FF/GPS several years ago and love it. I can't wiat to replace the old Furuno CRT radar, but ethanol will put that upgrade off a few more years. I do believe in redundant GPS/VHF though both installed and handheld. You just don't know what will happen which is the reason I kept my old Raymarine loran.

Post by **dougl33** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 12:12 pm

Shoot, I don't know that I'd even change them at 320hp. There are several guys on this board running 320hp Cats in their SF's. They all came from the factory with inch and 3/8's. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

CB35 · Post by **CB35** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:15 am

I have a 1984 3208T Cat 300HP. The shafts are 1.5" and the wheels are 3 blade Nibrals 20"X22" number 6 cup. Gears are 506TD's 1.5:1. If you want to upgrade tp 1.5" shaft you have to change lots of things including new props. Maybe you can leave that of some other upgrades. I do have one comment about running the boat at 2250 rpms. You are lugging the motors which is way worse then turning 10% under. The book that came with my Bertram recommended running between 2300 and 2500 rpms. If your boat is lightly loaded then maybe you can get away with 2250, but my boat is up on top and running good at 2350-2400 rpms. By the way the fuel burn vs distance vs time is just about the same for 2300-2500 rpms. At 2500 you are burning more per hour but you get there quicked then 2300 rpms. Anything more or less and you loose efficiency. Try her at 2350 for a while you my like the ride better. Your boat should also be proped to turn 2850 rpm WOT. Welcome aboard Charlie

IRGuy · Post by **IRGuy** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:46 am

My '83 FBC had Cat 3208's when it was new.. I believe they were the 260HP version, and in 1996 the previous owner repowered with Cummins 315 HP 6B's.. my hull was laid up in '81, but the boat is a '83 model. My shafts are 1 1/2". I don't think they were changed in the repower, so I believe in '81 Bertram was using 1 1/2" shafts, at least in some boats. BTW: My trans is 1.5:1, and my props are 21"D x 23" P.. 23 knots at 2,400 RPM. From all I have learned in the 7 months I have had the boat the engines specs say max RPM is 2,800, cruising should be no more than 2,600, and it is best to run for extended periods of time at 2,400, if I want to be kind to the engines. I can get about 2,950 RPM WOT, which indicates the props are correct for the boat with a full fuel tank, 4 POB, and some gear. Frank B - IRGuy@aol.com "Phoenix" 1983 FBC Wilmington, NC

Post by **dougl33** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 5:35 am

Frank, If that's the case, then yours is the first factory diesel boat I've heard of with 1.5 inch shafts (that's all years!). I've got the spec sheets from 1984 and it lists the diesels with 1.375. I could be wrong, but I doubt your 81 was given 1.5 inch shafts at the factory. The problem with boats this old is that its nearly impossible to figure out everything thats been done over the years. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

Brian Davin · Post by **Brian Davin** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 12:08 pm

Doug, My 1990 FBC Gas had 1 1/2 shafts before I upgraded to 1 3/4 with the diesel repower. I'd be curious what Jose Jaen has on his '93 with Diesel's from the factory? Brian '90 Bertram 33' FBC Never Say Never Guilford, CT (Homeport) Kinnelon, NJ (Home)

Post by **dougl33** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 1:02 pm

He has inch and 3/8's. Late in 86/early in 87 Bertram switched all the gas boats to inch and half shafts, but they left the diesels at inch and 3/8's through the end of production in 92/93. I know its weird, but thats how it is. Regards, Doug L. 1986 33 Bertram FBC Queen Elizabeth Marblehead, MA [img]http://www.bertram33.com/photogallery/p ... sabeth.jpg[/img]

bert35 · Post by **bert35** » Thu Sep 28, 2006 6:24 am

Inch and 3/8th's it will be! The deck in the salon was raised (only where the engines are). It should be fun to reconfigure the layout. Any suggestions on where to find cabinets and furniture? I want marine style furniture not seats found in West Marine. Interesting that the displacement for the 33 and 35 is only a few hundred pounds apart. They are awesome looking boats!

IRGuy · Post by **IRGuy** » Sun Oct 08, 2006 1:52 am

Bert35... Sorry to be late in responding here.. (I have been out of town working on my boat!).. I know of one Bert 33 that was repowered to diesel by a past owner several years ago that, when the present owner checked had 1 1/2" shafts, but when he looked at the struts one had a true 1 1/2" cutless bearing, and the other had an 1 3/8" cutless with the rubber insert bored out to 1 1/2". My point is that it is possible to put1 1/2" shafts in a boat with 1 3/8" struts and bore the cutless's out to 1 1/2" so you don't have to change the struts. Frank B - IRGuy@aol.com "Phoenix" 1983 FBC Wilmington, NC

franklyprice · Post by **franklyprice** » Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:42 am

Frank, Are you sure the cutless bearing was bored out to 1 1/2"? From what I've seen the struts are the same for both shaft sizes and the difference is that with the 1 1/2" shafts a bearing with a thinner shell was used. The company that makes the bearings gives them a name to designate the dimensions, the one for the 1 1/2" shafts with the thinner shell is called BOSS. Now that said,if anyone is going to change their shafts from 1 3/8" to 1 1/2" they should double check the bore of the strut to see if this is true for their boat but I believe you will find it to be true.